Somehow the EFI partition doesn’t mount and it’s impossible to troubleshoot via phone, she asked me to put back the old system 😞
If the EFI partition truly was at fault, you wouldn’t get into Linux. And if the issue is mounting the efi partition after booting, that shouldn’t be a critical error. So it sounds like something else is at fault IMO
I switched my Dad to Linux recently, and set his account up without any superuser access. Updates have to wait until I visit once a week, but it restricts his ability to get himself stuck in any update-related tangles.
Linux has problems, but I’m so glad I don’t have to support my Dad on Windows anymore, because that was far less predictable for me. Like the time it decided to upload all his files to onedrive (despite him having no knolwledge of this, or what it was doing or whether he’d consented or not) and made the Internet unusably slow for 8 hours by totally saturating his meagre connection.
He didn’t even know about onedrive, just phoned me like “The Internet isn’t working, what’s wrong?” and of course onedrive is the last thing I’d have suspected for causing that symptom, which made it so annoying to diagnose.
Much nicer now his OS doesn’t do sneaky things behind his back, or mine.
Great example of why a safety net is required.
Yes hopefully the “base” setup works once you installed it, hopefully manage through some updates, some even tinkerings… but what happens when it break?
Windows (despite all the criticism, and I’m one of the first to complain about Microsoft the corporation) usually has been fallback mechanisms. It can usually rollback an update. It usually has a hidden recovery partition. It usually has an alternative medium to recover (e.g. USB stick, CD-ROM back in the days, etc).
So… you genuinely did try to help your mother but do not give up. Try instead to provide a better safety net so that she is genuinely safer. In fact I would recommend testing it together, make it a learning adventure. One way to do so would be to go there, help her fix it… then botcher the setup together! Delete system files, etc, then try again. Obviously the 1st step is insuring her own data (e.g. family photo, documents, etc) is safe.
While doing so, you might also want to setup up remote control, or not. Anyway a LOT of things to genuinely discover together.
IMHO if you do do it, she will not only appreciate the effort but assuming you do manage, she’ll have a new sense of pride, both in you but also herself and share the experience with her friends. This in turn might bring more people in!
There also are distros with some kind of similar safety net. Immutable distros usually let you Boot previous versions if an update breaks something. This usually means that they need a lot of storage tho. https://itsfoss.com/immutable-linux-distros/
I have had to do this with fedora in the past and i was able to fix my boot issues and then go back to the newest version
I find it’s super rare any form of recovery actually works. best thing to do is pull the files you need off with a nvme/sata adapter then reinstall and replace those files. 90% when windows actually breaks there’s not much to be done (I try all forms of recovery every time though).
plus, 9/10 times the reinstall process is actually way faster than fighting with windows or searching for the problem online and getting hundreds of people asking you to run sfc \scannow.
super rare any form of recovery actually works. […] 90% when windows actually breaks
To clarify I used Windows as an example of an OS which manages its own recovery. I’m absolutely not suggesting to use Windows.
I’m personally using Debian so here are some examples of official resources :
- https://wiki.debian.org/SystemRescue
- https://www.debian.org/releases/stable/amd64/ch08s06.en.html
- https://wiki.debian.org/RescueLive which seems to rely https://wiki.debian.org/LiveCD which seems impractical for most, instead one could consider https://www.debian.org/releases/stable/amd64/apas02.en.html#howto-getting-images-usb
Honestly none of these look like practical options for somebody who is not working in IT.
Here are examples of community provided resources :
The very last one, namely Ventoy Linux Recovery Helper, looks quite interesting. Unfortunately there is literally 0 issue https://github.com/zudsniper/VLRH/issues which makes me think very few people might be actually using it. In fact while creating the first issue https://github.com/zudsniper/VLRH/issues/1 I noticed
# Created by Claude for Jasonin the header leading me to believe this was AI generated. Regardless of how it was done (sigh) it seems it was not thoroughly tested so I clearly would look for another alternative.
Loool, all the people who are trying to help you troubleshoot are 1) probably correct and 2) completely missing the point. I have a Windows desktop, a Mac, and a Linux desktop at home and this kind of shit only happens on Linux these days.
How am I the only one who does have annoying issues like this on Windows (except that Windows only gives a useless error code at most) while Linux has failed to boot a total of once (without me explicitly changing nvidia drivers).
You’re right, this never happens on windows. It’s so robust no one ever complains
/s
Literally happened updating just yesterday so I went to an older boot entry. The Matrix channel blamed my hardware, but the older revision boots just fine
Right but you see it never happened to that person so it means it’s like that for everybody else. Clearly you are wrong. /s
My MacBook is getting very long in the tooth and the updates via OCLP are working in creating a system that is painfully slow to use. I’ve been tinkering with various Linux distros for 20 years and the thought of having one as my only daily driver does not sound appealing. I really don’t want to drop the money on a new laptop but I need something to work without constantly troubleshooting.
I have Linux running on 6 different MacBooks (2009 - 2021). They were all EndeavourOS at first though some are Chimera Linux now.
They run great. Even the 2009 really.
Thank you. I’ve not tried EndeavorOS, so I’ll check it out! Most of what I’ve been running have been flavors of Ubuntu with a brief Gentoo and OpenSUSE period.
That happens when I select the wrong kernel in the systemd boot menu, before that screen. Doing nothing after an upgrade also selects the wrong version by default, it’s kinda annoying. I have to select the most up to date version and press Ctrl-D to make it the default on the next boot.
If that’s also what happens here, maybe a solution could be to keep only one kernel version and its fallback. But idk if you’re using systemd-boot or grub
You might try using rEFInd instead.
I also have a “current” kernel and an LTS one. If current ever has an issue, I just reboot into LTS.
It has saved me on Arch at least once.
RIP, this is sad day today
It’s good your mom tried. It’s sad she gave up so soon. I’ve helped 4 people switch in the past months. I’ve gotten even more people curious and more open to switch. A success is not only the switch, but that people start to realize that they can. In my opinion. :-)
Really out of my depth here, but anyway—
What model computer does your mom have? Does it by any chance have solid state drives that are RAID 0?
Have you tried Linux Mint? After really struggling with Fedora, I was able to get Mint up and running after a few minimal problems and haven’t looked back since.
At least your mom was cool enough to try. I had to trick my mom into using linux by putting a macOS themed, KDE, debian on an old macbook that was identical to her dead macbook
Was she tricked? I would think the jig would be up the second she clicked on something.
My mom is old. Her whole workflow is just open the browser and go to gmail, and forward me a bunch of spams…
Whether its on iOS or debian, you can’t tell the difference unless you’re looking hard
Would be tricked if you just say “apple forced an update.”
Could it be a dying SSD?
Out of curiosity what did you install ? And what did you install it on ?
Is this a Dell machine or something similar? It’s not impossible that the internal battery has run dry, and it reset the UEFI settings. A lot of setups would refuse to work if internal storage mode has switched from AHCI to hardware RAID
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